Legislature(2001 - 2002)
05/02/2002 10:41 AM Senate RLS
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
CHAIRMAN PHILLIPS announced the committee would take up HB 206- LIMITED ENTRY FOR COMM. FISHERIES and asked for an explanation of the measure. MS. MARY MCDOWELL, Commercial Fisheries Entry Commission (CFEC), told members that HB 206 is the result of a 1996 legislative directive to place a moratorium on vessels in the Korean hair crab fishery. The legislature directed the CFEC to work with the Department of Law (DOL) to draft legislation that would create a vessel-based limited entry program that could be used in fisheries that can't be affected under the current program. Those fisheries do not have the characteristics of the fisheries normally limited by the state. The vessels are not owner operated, they are large and use multiple skippers. CFEC was originally directed by the legislature to draft legislation that is generic and would create an alternative program that could be used for fisheries with those characteristics. However, when the bill was heard in the House Resources Committee, it was considered to be very controversial. People were concerned about diverging from the current program and creating a generic tool for future fisheries. At that point, the House Resources Committee narrowed the scope of the legislation to say the only fisheries this new tool could be applied to are the Korean hair crab fishery and the weathervane scallop fishery, the two large boat fisheries that the state is immediately faced with having to limit. The legislature imposed vessel based moratoria in both of those fisheries. HB 206 will provide CFEC with a tool to deal with those fisheries before they return to open access at the expiration of the moratoria. The hair crab moratorium expires in July of 2003 so CFEC needs legislation to pass this session to have this tool available. SENATOR HALFORD asked why it must pass this session. MS. MCDOWELL explained that in order to enact a limitation in a fishery, CFEC will have to propose a limitation system and put it out in the form of a regulatory proposal and provide for a 60 day public notice period. If HB 206 doesn't pass until next session, CFEC will not have time to do that before the moratorium is lifted. SENATOR HALFORD asked when the season for Bering Sea hair crab begins. MS. MCDOWELL said it begins in November. SENATOR HALFORD maintained that CFEC would have time to develop regulations before the season. MS. MCDOWELL said that part of the problem is that once the moratorium expires, people are eligible to apply for an interim use permit for the calendar year before CFEC restricts who is eligible. CFEC has been involved in lawsuits about the effective date in the past so it feels it is up against a deadline. CHAIRMAN PHILLIPS suggested holding the bill for 24 hours. SENATOR HALFORD said that both sides of this conflict have a legitimate argument. The legislature directed CFEC to place a vessel-based - not individual based - moratoria on those fisheries. He said this is the one place in the system where some kind of a business ownership permit is being created, rather than an individual permit. The point he has argued is that he does not want to create any new permits with any value. He is not unwilling to create new permits, but if those permits are transferable for value, the state has created an artificial value that comes down on the fishery. He noted there are very few hair crab or scallop vessels, but this method will set a precedent. Senator Halford said he thought Representative Scalzi planned to talk to Ms. McDowell about another permutation and asked if she spoke to him recently. MS. MCDOWELL said he talked to her several days ago about the possibility of coming up with a method of non-transferability. She said she explained to him that CFEC would have to come up with a new method of transferring new permits whereby permits would have to revert to CFEC and be redistributed through a lottery or some similar method. She noted that would be risky for the current program because permits would leave the hands of Alaskans. She pointed out that 30 to 40 percent of all permits now change hands by gift rather than sale because they change hands within families. That would be less applicable to vessel permits. SENATOR HALFORD asked if you could get them out with no notice in February in the community closest to where the permit is fished. MS. MCDOWELL said that interstate commerce issues come into play. SENATOR HALFORD maintained that it is difficult to come up with a method that avoids a value in the permits and that he is not against the particular fishery. MS. MCDOWELL acknowledged that this issue has had many, many hearings. CHAIRMAN PHILLIPS noted the purpose of this hearing is to schedule. SENATOR THERRIAULT said he has a concern similar to Senator Halford's in that he has always been bothered by the value that is placed on the right to take the collective resource. CHAIRMAN PHILLIPS noted he will hold HB 206 in committee for 24 hours. SENATOR HALFORD said he believes there is a better method but it will require a lot of work and no one is better qualified to figure out that method than CFEC. He said the legislature has discussed this question over and over and now the moratoria are going to run out. He indicated that it may be difficult to come up with a process other than a cash transfer but it is not impossible. As a matter of policy, it would be the right direction to go in. He said he does not want to participate in creating new permits for value because that debt load represents half of the load the fisheries are dealing with today. SENATOR THERRIAULT asked if the moratoria can be extended. MS. MCDOWELL said this one has been extended already and that CFEC will run into another constitutional problem if it continues to extend it. The moratorium has created an exclusive class so that those people are locked in with no opportunity to exchange permits. Extending the moratorium indefinitely is problematic as well. SENATOR TAYLOR indicated that he has been working on this issue for about four years and said that part of the frustration is that the legislature suppressed this question with each of the moratoriums and in fact gave direction to the CFEC. He said he agrees with Senator Halford on the value issue but he would hate to see this very small and unique fishery remain closed because no answer has been found yet. SENATOR HALFORD said the issue raises two questions: one is in regard to the fact that the permits are not individually owned, which was mandated by the legislature; the other is transferability. MS. MCDOWELL pointed out that because the bill has been dramatically narrowed, it creates a less sweeping policy call than it might have been if it was a generic bill. CHAIRMAN PHILLIPS announced that he would hold the bill until the next meeting. He then adjourned the meeting at 11:04 a.m.
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